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Old 09-19-2006
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PT-The Italian Commie PT-The Italian Commie is offline
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Originally Posted by JCoyote
I've distrusted Ratzinger from the first pic I saw of him. His choice of a medieval papal name is telling, as is his statements regarding having a smaller, more committed church. (Guess what that meant when the medieval pope he named himself for talked about such things?) He was Hitler Jugend, and it's stupid but Sgt. Fury and the Howling Commandoes called the nazis... ratzis. Funny coincidence.

Roger that!

Originally Posted by JCoyote
That said, he was actually making an honest point about the contradiction of faith through violence. It is very telling that in response to a centuries old accusation that Islam spreads faith through violence, a number of Islamists have responded to this vile lie by saying they will spread their faith through violence.

Yes, but don't forget that also Christianship has an history of "spreading faith through violence". Words "Crusades", "Witch Hunt", "Inquisition" ring any bell? I seriously hope so.

Originally Posted by JCoyote
Ummm... wasn't Ratzinger trying to make a point about belief involving reason?

If you want my two cents, Pope Ratzy knew since the very beginning that such expressions would have pissed off a lot of violent people, and did it INTENTIONALLY to PROVOKE such reactions. Which are NOT GOOD, okay, but provoking them isn't good either. The Pope is between the top ones to have all to gain and very little to loose in a clash between civilizations and religions. Remember: he is the chief of the CATHOLIC Church. "Catholic" is from ancient Greek, and means "Universal". The name says it all: the "Catholic" Church is founded upon the self-belief of being the only one with the revealed truth (a feature that it shares with A LOT of other organized religions, after all... ), and much like radical Islam, regardless of any "sign of distention and dialogue", it has very little consideration for non-believers and for believers of other religions. A clash between civilizations and religions, caused by his statement, would only give to the Catholic Church in general, and to Ratzinger personally, just some more points: in their mind, they would show just how "barbaric" the "others" are, and would adfirm the superiority of the Catholicism in confrontation with all other religions.

Originally Posted by JCoyote
Does ANYONE in the Islamic world realize that a harsh reaction to the Pope's statements proves him right

Hmmm, NO, I don't think so. Not only the Muslims don't realize it; but not even a "Westerner" like me does. As I stated above, I am firmly persuaded of the fact that Ratzinger has deliberately made such a speech to cause a reaction in the radical/fundamentalist Islamic mob.

Yet, if he is wrong, and sure he -IS- dead wrong, the Islamic fundamentalists are even WRONGER. Now that I made some researches, I can adfirm for sure that the statements that "The army of Islam will conquer Rome as promised by the Prophet", and all that shit, was made by an organization called the "Council of the Mujaheddins", an Iraqi-based extremist/terrorist group that merged into Al-Qaeda up recently. You will understand, them are not EXACTLY what I call "moderate interlocutors"...

Nonetheless, when they menace to burn down Rome, I get pissed off NOT because they are menacing to burn down the heart of Christianship (I couldn't give a shit less); but because they are menacing to burn down the CAPITAL CITY OF MY COUNTRY, which is based on Constitutional principles that I share and admire and am faithful to, and which I am willing to protect with my own life if necessary.

Now, basically, I -DO- respect Muslims. I really do. I have my ideas about the current world situation, and that's it: you think it is a clash of civilizations? It's NOT. The religion, and all that shit, is only a "façade". The point is that on THAT side there is the Third World, an impressive number of poor people with nothing to loose and conscious of the fact that the Western World founds its wellness and opulence on the over-exploitment of the (poor) world resources. On the OTHER side ("our" side, or so it should be) there is the "Western World", a very rich minority who KNOWS VERY WELL what they have done to the planet in the last 60/100 years and what they are still doing to, but which is NOT WILLING to give away not one single little bit of its opulence, which wants MORE AND MORE, even should this make necessary the slaughter of billions. THIS is what we are facing, and I am not sure that I'd want, or like, to be on "our" side.

But menaces to my home Country, that's a whole another story. As for the current situation, Italy is much more a "Non-Aligned" Country, with the new Government heavily engaged in diplomacy efforts to help the cause of PEACE between the two "civilizations" or "worlds" or however you want to call them. This does not means that we will droop our heads to an attack against the unity and the independence of our Country. I'll be the first to grab a gun if an army of Islamo-Fascists attacks Italy.
And the best is, I known a number of Muslims living in Italy that are ready to do the same as well.

P.S.: I don't know what Bacon Guy thinks that I am, an idiot or some thing. I thought he had read the writing on the wall. He is on my PERMANENT IGNORE LIST. I do not read his messages. He can spare himself the bothering to reply to my posts. Them are not for him, and I will not read his replies.
"It is criminal to teach a man not to defend himself, when he is the constant victim of brutal attacks. It is legal and lawful to own a shotgun or a rifle. We believe in obeying the law." -- Malcolm X

"We (atheists) act in good conscience because we believe in moral principles, not because we expect a reward in Heaven." -- Margherita Hack

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