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Old 10-27-2006
Cesare's Avatar
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Question D.I.M.E. in Israel?

Can anybody tell me about DIME? Is it toxic? Has the US sold it to the Israelis? Haaretz (Israel) & RAI24 (Italy) reported of such.
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Old 10-27-2006
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Exclamation Dense Inert Metal Explosive

Sorry, CESARE, I haven't followed RAI-NEWS 24 in a while, now.

If you are talking about "Dense Inert Metal Explosive", well, our resident explosives expert is UZI, who's Israeli, or at least an Israeli-American, so I wouldn't take his words for the best in impartiality about the possible toxicity of the D.I.M.E. (especially upon Palestinians); nonetheless, he will surely provide you much more insight about the D.I.M.E. than I can do.

Anyhow, the WIKIPEDIA link I added above clearly states:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wikipedia
The explosive casing is made of carbon fibre which disintegrates upon detonation (vs. the shrapnel which results from the fragmentation of a metal casing). The explosive fill is mixed with a very dense powder of a heavy metal tungsten alloy (HMTA) such as cobalt and nickel or iron. The HMTA powder forms a micro-shrapnel which is very lethal at close range, but loses inertia very quickly due to air resistance. The downward-facing direction of the blast means that survivors close to the lethal zone may have their legs amputated (slicing through bone and soft tissue) and can subsequently contract cancer (rhabdomyosarcoma) from the HMTA micro-shrapnel embedded in their body tissue.

The carcinogenic effects of heavy metal tungsten alloys (HMTA) have been studied by the U.S. Armed Forces since at least 2000 (along with depleted uranium (DU)). These alloys were found to cause neoplastic transformations of human osteoblast cells:

* rWNiCo: tungsten (91-93%), nickel (3-5%) and cobalt (2-4%)
* rWNiFe: tungsten (91-93%), nickel (3-5%) and iron (2-4%)

A more recent U.S. Department of Health study in 2005 found that HMTA shrapnel rapidly induces rhabdomyosarcomas in rats.

As reported in French national newspaper LE MONDE, according to a team of journalists from the Italian news agency RAI, DIME-type bombs were being used in the Gaza strip by the Israeli army, Tsahal, against Palestinian targets during July/August 2006. The investigation was performed by analysing samples of metals found in the victim's bodies and examining the unusual wounds. Israel denied possessing or using such weapons.

Follow the embedded links to know more.

On a side note, I like to see that the Wikipedians don't know that RAI is not an "Italian news agency" but the ITALIAN STATE RADIO-TELEVISION.
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Last edited by PT-The Italian Commie : 10-27-2006 at 12:22 PM.
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Old 10-27-2006
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Great, thanks for the links, i guess this could be a sensitve subject? And yes Dense Inert Metal Explosive is of course what i was talking about. the little i've seen shows a munition that usually is too good to be true as many other miracle or smart munitions. Especially those within the field of less-lethal or "LCD".
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Old 10-28-2006
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Exclamation UZI where are U?

I want to "hear" the other side of this.
As stated before, PT is a very good source of info's (I just disagree 'bout his "red" bla bla bla).

Now, the word to the defendant

. let's see who pissed out of the pot .
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Old 10-28-2006
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Okay, for a start I'll admit I do not know as much about DIME as I do most other weapons, but I'll spill what I've heard.

DIME isn't an explosive itself. Simply a high-density metal powder imbedded in a conventional high explosive. It acts as micro-shrapnel, causing a small 'no survival' zone around the bomb when it goes off, but leaving most anything outside of that intact.

Really, the effect isn't too different from what very light grade birdshot acts like [in fact, wasn't there at least one brand of birdshot made of tungsten?].

Also, I wouldn't assume either side is correct in the tungsten-health-effects debate yet. The ones claiming that it causes cancer are basing it on a handful of very questionable tests. On the other side of that, there really have been no tests that have disproved what those tests have said. Really, there hasn't been any set of honest tests done on this.

Personally, I find it hard to believe tungsten has serious health effects [beyond what any heavy metal has... Obviously chewing on it would be a bad idea, just like lead]. Tungsten is used in a lot of industry.. I mean a LOT of industry. Some of the planes I flew once upon a time used tungsten blocks for weight and ballance control, for example. I didn't drop dead from cancer. Most lightbulbs contain a tungsten element, and those are made by the billions each year by factory workers with only minimal protective gear. You would think there would be reports of problems if Tungsten was some demon-metal.

Besides, it isn't limited to tungsten... other heavy metals could be used, however with slightly reduced effect. We could always use Depleted Urainium, but someone would bitch about that too.


Also, most of the crap being put out by the Italian Ministery for Public Enlightenment is bullshit. They take random pictures of some guy who has been dead for three days and dried in the sun and then scream "OMG OMG OMG HE LOOKS HORRIBLE!!!!!11!11!!11!one!!"

Well now, that's suprising, dead guy, died days ago, in a war, left baking in sun, and he looks bad? Who would have thought?

As anyone who has actually seen what happens to bodies left out in the elements can tell, most of what is seen is the result of the sun. Skin shrinks, bakes, becomes black and/or turns into leather... Why does this shock people? It isn't some new super-weapon, it's the freaking sun. Leave a strip of meat outside in it for a few days and watch what happens [well, maybe it's a bad time of year, being close to winter, but a few months ago it was warmer].

The rest? Blown off limbs? Pellets imbedded where doctors can't remove them? Seen that film before, it was called the Civil War, and it happened in 1861. Look up 'grapeshot' and 'canister'.


Finally, a request for PT: Do not call me an Israeli. I have never been an Israeli citizen. While I have great love for Israel, I am an American and a Texan, damnit! And as long as this country remains loyal to its Constitution, an American I will stay. There is a home for me in Israel, and it is possible I could move there someday if things go totally to shit here. That day hasn't happened. Until then Israel is my spiritual home, not my national home.

From this point on every time I am called an Israeli, I will call you a Roman.
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