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  #11  
Old 03-21-2007
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I heard of them but must admit that i have never shot/handled a Walther P99 (which are made in many configurations, is this a feature on all of them?) or any other gun with Trigger safety for that matter. Never struck me as a particularly interesting idea, but now i perhaps have to add this to my list of future experiences.
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  #12  
Old 03-21-2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cesare
I heard of them but must admit that i have never shot/handled a Walther P99 (which are made in many configurations, is this a feature on all of them?)...

YEP, that is.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cesare
...or any other gun with Trigger safety for that matter. Never struck me as a particularly interesting idea, but now I perhaps have to add this to my list of future experiences.

A trigger safety is, to say, what allows a Glock to have no manual safety whatsoever (and, no matter what TJ says, and sincerely sorry for my fellow countrymen at Beretta, GLOCK pistols are still the best out there). Other pistols featuring a trigger safety are the SITES / Modulo Masterpiece "Resolver" (Italy), the Smith&Wesson SW-99 series (USA), just to name the most famous and not mentioning the enormous amount of long arms that feature it. The Glock trigger safety is particularly effective since, to say, unables the tiny hands of a child to pull the trigger all the way (and my Editor-In-Chief, who both owns a Glock and has two children, a 5-y-o male and a 11-months female, is extremely happy of this).
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  #13  
Old 03-21-2007
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Glock pistols are the best out there? You said you write for a gun magazine and you say Glock pistols are the best out there? I gotta call BS on that one. No where near the best. Maybe they are out there in the highest numbers but I don't think there is any gun manufacturer anywhere at any time that has had to pay out more money as a result of class action lawsuits against their product.
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  #14  
Old 03-21-2007
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Slip of the, ehh finger... Meant to write "mag-release", (not trigger safety) never seen a magazine release connected-incorporated into the triggerguard, but im rather more used to the push-button release. I think this would take some time to get used to, especially in speed-reload or tactical reload (using off-hand to extract and insert) but of course its a matter of training.

While on the subject TJ, what is the BEST pistol around then? Law-suits is not really a good measure of how good a pistol is. But i agree that glock has its issues.
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  #15  
Old 03-22-2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cesare
While on the subject TJ, what is the BEST pistol around then? Law-suits is not really a good measure of how good a pistol is. But i agree that glock has its issues.

But there is much MUCH worse.

For example: being like TJ, stating that SIGs are the best pistols out there.

You want to say which are the best out there?

#1 - GLOCK (some hundreds of thousands of Italians between private owners, shooters, Private Security individuals, Town Police and national LE Special Forces can't be wrong!).
#1,5 - BERETTA (again, see above).
#2 - TANFOGLIO.
#3 AND UNDER - All the rest: who gives a fuck BTW.
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  #16  
Old 03-22-2007
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Tanfoglio is a CZ copy...
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  #17  
Old 03-22-2007
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SiG is pretty high on my score... Better than Glock, for sure.

HK used to be at the top of my list, but lost that about five years ago.
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  #18  
Old 03-22-2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roger
Tanfoglio is a CZ copy way better than the original

Fixed it for you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by UZI4U
SiG is pretty high on my score...

I am NOT denying this at all... yet, go at the post about Zoran Bezanovic's "Bravo 5 Perfect Handgun", and see what I wrote about 6 hours ago. When going for a pistol, people looks for SIMPLICITY. The Glock -IS- simple. Just point it at the target and pull the trigger. No safeties to thinker with, or external things of which operation you might/should be concerned. Glock is also pretty lightweight and compact in design for all-day carry.
And, despite what you Americans hink/say, the Glocks work flawlessly. No KBs or slamfires ever reported in Italy, nor I have ever heard of any reported in Europe. As for Glocks gone KB in USA, well, is like for the BerettaM92-FS/M9 slides separating from the frame during the early years of US military service: it all depends from the kind of load you use... or that you "used to use". Beretta has solved the problem making the gun stronger so that it will actually handle SMG loads. Unaware if Glock has done the same. The problem/risk with home-reloaded cartridges still remains...

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Originally Posted by UZI4U
Better than Glock, for sure.

I would not bet my ass upon that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by UZI4U
HK used to be at the top of my list, but lost that about five years ago.

H&K has made a lot of mistakes in the past, and what's worse is that it's continuing to do them! Their policy of "Tactical weapons only for Military/LE" is making them loose A LOT of marketspace. Do you know how much people there's out there waiting for a semiauto-civvie G-36 or XM8 that will most probably never come?
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  #19  
Old 03-22-2007
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I think one should diffrentiate the answer to which one is the best. Glock as a military pistol is very good, sturdy, capable of firing diffrent kinds of ammo (to a certain extent), heat-cold response, but foremost operationabillity and simplicity (very important for a std mil handgun). I have nothing but good things to say about tanfoglio, but the qualities here (which in my opinion surpasses glock) is more suited to sport and "personal defense" use. SIG's in general score high in both of these areas. My point just being that one has to consider a handgun as a mean to a specific end, to fully be able to talk about which one is "the best there is".
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  #20  
Old 03-22-2007
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All military firearms should have a manual safety. Everyone in the military is trained to use a manual safety, and the one on the Tanfoglio is very well placed and intuitive. You drop the safety on the draw, no time elapse or fumbling.

Beretta actually has some truly terrible slide mounted safeties out there. The decocker ishard and clunky, and makes a frighteningly loud clack when used, felt like dry firing hte gun. Not precisely a problem, but it's a good idea not to have your gun do things that are counter indicated or dangerous in the vast majority of weapons. Like pulling a trigger to take it apart.

I've never liked in-trigger safeties. Either they are a safety risk, because any foreign object entering the triggerguard can fire the weapon, or they constrain your trigger pull to that suited to "average" hands. I do not have average hands, I have freakishly long fingers that find even Desert Eagles comfortable to grip.

As far as being a CZ clone, Tanfoglio is an improved version of an already excellent design. The design still has the best overall ergonomics and handling qualities out there. There are some garbage guns out there, Tanfoglios aren't one of them, nor are CZ 75's. The only thing I could wish for with mine is a decocking lever, that would function like the one on my Sig, allowing me to gently drop the hammer safely. And I much prefer slide inside frame over the usual.

Beretta - Lack of caliber variety (especially in combat calibers), awkward slide mounted safeties.

Glock - Unsupported chamber, no option for manual safety, pulling the trigger to strip.

Sig - No option for manual safety, boreline unneccessarily high leading to excess muzzle flip.

Tangfoglio - No decocker option.

Each has some problems but really it seems Tanfoglio has the lesser of the evils. But they also lack the PR departments of the other weapons and the bureaucratic buddies to get the huge contracts. (Let's be honest, half of handgun decisions by militaries are based on politics and PR. Ones by police departments are based on the same, with availability and image thrown in.)
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